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Sur-pri-ise!
Posted 9/13/2012 3:55:00 AM

So, the cost of the arena complex is going to be more than first thought, and some on council are surprised.  I’m surprised that they’re surprised.  Cost over-runs are part of construction.  It is better we find out about it now than after we’ve passed the point of no return, so maybe it is surprising we find out in advance.  Now it’s gone from $450 to $470 million dollars - an extra 20 million.  The Katz group would pay half, and the mayor does not think 10 million for the city is a deal breaker, but council did say no to topping it up with public money.  So, how do we handle this surprise sticker shock?  Does council surprise you by actually asking you about spending more public money?  Is the ticket tax increased?  Does some organization touting the benefits of this new complex surprise us by sponsoring the shortfall?  Or, do we stay on budget and adjust the blueprints to come up with a building that’s still grand, but not grandiose.  Or, maybe you have a better idea that will satisfy both sides.  Let me know your preference.  Surprise me.

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Posted By: Bob Layton  

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  • 25
  1. Richard posted on 09/13/2012 06:22 AM This comment was edited by a moderator at 07:20 AM on 09/13/2012
    The thing is Bob you seem to think this is the end of cost overuns - It's not, this is just the beggining.
    Did I suprise you?

    Bob replies: I'm surprised you think I'm that dumb.
    1. Richard posted on 09/13/2012 08:46 AM
      @Richard No, but the jury is out on our City Council. (Silver Balls)
    2. The Infidel - Mr. John posted on 09/13/2012 11:29 AM
      @Richard Actually Richard,...it is the BEG INNING!
    show more replies
  2. Graham posted on 09/13/2012 07:49 AM
    That is a very longwinded explanation regarding elected officials treating, expecting, and knowing the people who elected them are stooges. Long live the idiots is every politicians mantra.
  3. Bill posted on 09/13/2012 07:49 AM
    I agree with you Bob, why would anyone be surprised. Now the next big question is how much is the mayor going to ask coucil to raise taxes next year for his landmark building to be made. Why can't they build just a funtional building instead of a landmark building or better yet renovate the coloseum for a lot less.
    If Katz wants a new building he can pay for it. If he disagrees with that, I will miss the Oilers, but then again I will be able to afford to live in this city.
    1. Bob $ posted on 09/13/2012 11:25 AM
      @Bill "If Katz wants a new building he can pay for it. " Amen to that Bill!
    show more replies
  4. Joy posted on 09/13/2012 08:09 AM
    Yes, a ticket surcharge. So, ticketmaster makes money, the city recoups its losses, the performers get paid (as they should) and the cost of running the place is covered. The ticket prices will be so expensive that no one will be able to afford to attend the events. Let them eat cake!
  5. GFF posted on 09/13/2012 09:48 AM This comment was edited by a moderator at 10:27 AM on 09/13/2012
    Mandel must truly feel he can get away AGAIN with scamming the tax payers of Edmonton! He appears on TV like a wiped dog, says this is a surprise. Katz group threatens to take the oilers out of Edmonton ..... don't let the door hit you on your way out AND take Mandel with you!! Every spring we hear what the taxes are going to be and then Mandel get on and says he will hopefully be able to convince council to find a way to keep them down. What a farce!
  6. Rayzor64 [deleted] posted on 09/13/2012 10:13 AM
    if he's the owner of the team, he should pay for everything, if I run a business, i pay to keep it alfoat, pay your taxes like everyone else, and stop holding the city hostage, the NHL would probably not allow the team to move anyway, where would they go?I do agree a new arena is agreat idea, but if he wants to run it, and collect all the profits, he should maintain, and pay for everything, just like the eskimos do, they seem to be doing fine, or let the city run it entirely, and have the money go directly back to the community like it should!
    1. Bob $ posted on 09/17/2012 06:55 PM
      @Rayzor64 [deleted] The drift that I am getting from ALL of this is, Katz, personally, doesn't have the money to build this arena. It's a big shell game as described, and Mandell and this council don't have the kahoona's upstairs or down, to leave the table...because they aren't playing with their money!
  7. The Infidel - Mr. John posted on 09/13/2012 10:55 AM
    Just a flipping minute here folks.
    I remember that there was a review by the council where they instructed the Katz group to cut some of the "extravaganzas" to reduce the cost. Now they are saying that there will be an overrun!
    So what the hell was the point of all that exercise? To appease the Edmonton taxpayers! I, for one am not appeased!!!
    I think it is about time that the taxpayers and council of Edmonton tell "Billionaire Boy" and his "Billionaire Boy Buddies"....to start digging into their own pockets to make up the difference,...and in fact,...THE TOTAL for the cost of this arena.
    This is just a "bait and switch" tactic and it surprisingly appears that even the "Silver Balls council" is being blindsided. When one of them was asked that directly,...she had a stunned look on her face and a long pause before she could even think of a response.
    Get with it Council....they are screwing with you and in the long run, screwing with the Edmonton Taxpayers....
    There will be NO END to these cost overruns...and this arena will run up to a BILLION dollars and the "Alison government" has already said they will not support it!!!!
    This whole thing sounds like a construction scam out of Quebec,...anybody else get that???
  8. Senator George posted on 09/13/2012 11:24 AM This comment was edited by a moderator at 04:53 AM on 09/14/2012
    My understanding is that they have already deferred their share of paying for this arena, as previously described the "Porkchop Palace" for thirty years already, yet expecting to reap ALL the profits from day one for ANY event that would be held there!
    If the carrot being held in front of the donkey is the Oilers, then let them go! When was the last time that they won a Stanley Cup anyway? It appears Katz and his group aren't any better at negotiating there than they are in negotiating here!
  9. Ken posted on 09/13/2012 11:49 AM This comment was edited by a moderator at 04:52 AM on 09/14/2012
    This will revitalize downtosn Edmonton. Give your head a shake. After the game most people will want to get home and not spend time eating or drinking downtown but rather get home. And some of the arena money will come from some sort of 'pie in the sky' scheme that will take 20 years for the city to get the money back. 20 years??? Sounds like in 20 years the call will be for a NEW arena as this one is too old.
    1. Bob $ posted on 09/14/2012 09:14 AM
      @Ken That is exactly what I said about 2 years ago when they started yapping about this project Ken.
      To prove your point for you, anyone should go down to the Coliseum LRT station after a game and see the immediate "exodus" from that place,...cleared out in less than an hour. Checking with the bar people across the road,...they have exactly the same feeling,...almost nobody comes in there after a game to stay for any length of time and with the .05 drinking law, that puts the final nail in the coffin.
      OH! Wait! You can't go down to the Coliseum Station cause they're NOT playing and probably won't be playing for maybe a year or two! Let's wait until then SHALL WE!?!
  10. PaddyD posted on 09/13/2012 11:56 AM
    Maybe the Katz group should contact Jerry Jones and learn how he got his sports complex built. The new Texas Stadium for the Dallas Cowboys.

    Paddy
  11. David W. Lincoln posted on 09/13/2012 12:31 PM
    As long as Katz wants to be the only one that is private, in this private/public partnership - what he wants will be more than what is possible.
  12. DarylJ_5855 posted on 09/13/2012 12:35 PM
    Nothing surprises me anymore when it comes to political posturing. When will these pundits ever get it through their head that there is no magical money tree for their expensive palaces? I won't pay $250 for concert seats anymore, nor will I pay $100+ for Oilers seats, and I won't go to the CFR, or other events that the new facility will house. Besides, the spoiled brats and the money monger owners won't be filling the buildings this year (old buildings either) anyway. When you have to threaten strike for being paid to play a game, and the big bad owners have to call a lock out on their own creations, it's time for a major rethink of what our entertainment is worth. Wanna do something worthy of tax increases? fFinish fixing the damage the the Queen of Green inflicted with her apathetic non-maintenance program.
  13. bryan posted on 09/13/2012 06:53 PM This comment was edited by a moderator at 04:50 AM on 09/14/2012
    well 20 million is a lot of money.... But Kartz will pay half.. so its only 10 million...... if you took the cost over run on the last 5 or 6 major projects the city has undertaken
    the cost over run would pay for the entire building.... so where were all these winers when this was going on ???????

    Bob replies: The cost over-runs did not benefit a businessman, they were for everyone.
  14. Susan posted on 09/13/2012 10:44 PM
    So Rexall Place is good enough for SIR Paul McCartney but not Darryl Katz? Interesting...
  15. Eva posted on 09/14/2012 09:00 AM
    Municipal funds... Provincial funds....it doesn't matter. If this goes through, it's a excellent example of how 99% of the population keep the 1% rich.
  16. Brian posted on 09/16/2012 09:12 AM This comment was edited by a moderator at 10:00 AM on 09/16/2012
    No Bob I am not surprised by anything this lot comes up with. Of course there will be further cost overruns, as with virtually every project Edmonton undertakes. One of the other hidden costs no one seems to talk about it is the enormous upgrade to the downtown infrastructure that will be required. How much will that add to the true cost? This could potentially bankrupt Edmonton. What private investor would be interested in a one sided deal like this and for 35 years? That is why there are none, its a horrible deal.

    Anyone who believes this behemoth will "revitalize" downtown likely still believes in the Easter bunny too. I guess the majority of city council does not realize the whole world is in economic crisis and somehow, magically, this luxurious fantasy will work out. Now back to reality.

    Bob replies: I believe they are already figuring in the cost LRT, etc.
  17. Mind of Reason posted on 09/17/2012 12:16 PM
    I think they should pull the plug on this deal,...NOW,...while there is no hockey season, this year of next. This striker will go on for 2 years. This season and next season.
    No hockey for 2 years,...how will we ever survive?
    Pull the plug, send Mr. Katz on a one way trip to somewhere. Let him try and sell his team....to WHO! Maybe he and his group will finally get the message,...your shell game is over. We know where you hid your pea! Move on, the gig is UP!
  18. Ron posted on 09/17/2012 06:36 PM
    No surprise here. Katz group is trying to hold a gun to the heads hockey fans and business and who can blame him for trying. Does anyone remember how Peter Pocklington did a very similar thing back 30 or so years ago? Funny how these things repeat themselves and everyone forgets.....
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