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No Zeros
Posted 6/5/2012 3:42:00 AM

A university professor emails to say a high school No-Zero policy brings into question just how well some students are prepared for university.  He’s seeing students who lack analytical, research and writing skills.  I can relate.  I was an adult at the U of A with a class of students just out of High School.  When the Prof came in with the first essays, she threw them on the floor and told the shocked students to get down and find their miserable excuse for a writing assignment.  There were tears as she told them their teachers had not prepared them for university.  I’m hearing from employers both in and out of the broadcasting business, who talk about the number of grads who apply for a first job who have trouble writing a sentence, can’t spell, and seem to think an apostrophe is just thrown in at random before the letter S.  Have you seen the signs around the city with flying apostrophes?  Does a High School diploma not require basic rules of punctuation?  Have they stopped teaching that, or do they just not want to give a zero if they don’t know it?  Let me know your hiring experience.

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Posted By: Bob Layton  

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  • 19
  1. David W. Lincoln posted on 06/05/2012 11:01 AM
    "They pretend to pay" "we pretend to work" is something I recall reading in a Time Magazine article about the Soviet Union. I used it when my teacher asked for a comparison between a command economy and a market economy. My examples were the US and the Soviet Union.

    We were also to compare the government chambers.

    Would students today be able to handle a comparison of, say, Canada and Iran? I have my doubts. So, what now?
  2. Allen posted on 06/05/2012 11:14 AM
    There's a document out there called "The Dumbing Down of America". Search it in google. This may very well explain what is happening to our children in school.
    1. Allen posted on 06/05/2012 04:22 PM
      @Allen Just to add to that last message...it's actually called The Deliberate Dumbing Down of America...and yes there is a website....
  3. Bob $ posted on 06/05/2012 11:50 AM
    I thnk t@ we shud continu to alow owr chldrn to dvlop ther langwg skkkils youzng there tumbz onli,..inn 5/10 yrz wee wll b gruntng lik cavmn an retrn 2 owr routs an mybe hav lrned a valubull leson sew wi don''''t mak thu sam mstak 2wice!
  4. Richard posted on 06/05/2012 12:18 PM
    I have always thought that the primary responsibility for the education of a child belongs to the parents. The schools are there to help the parents perform this function. I know that today this is a radical notion. It is NOT the teacher's responsibility to pursue the student for an assignment, it is the student's and parents' responsibility to submit the assignment. High school students aren't stupid.

    When you get what you've EARNED, you DESERVE what you get.
    1. Bob $ posted on 06/06/2012 09:18 AM
      @Richard As my friends on the colony say: "You reap wut you sew!"
  5. Graham posted on 06/05/2012 01:28 PM
    Drivers' licence tests are available in ten languages ... what's so special about english?
  6. Barry N posted on 06/05/2012 02:43 PM
    Sorry,don't have a hiring story,but I do have a related spelling story. I am a frequent poster on a Edmonton discussion forum. Recently someone posted a comment that was riddled with atrocious spelling errors. Several poster took him to task about his numerous errors,and what did we get ? We were told where to go and what bus to take to get there. Plus we were reminded in no uncertain terms to back off on pointing out his errors.
    1. Bob $ posted on 06/06/2012 09:25 AM This comment was edited by a moderator at 05:51 PM on 06/06/2012
      @Barry N "Several poster took him to task about his numerous errors"
      Did you mean: "Several people took him to task?" Sorry, if that is not an arror!
      This is true story Bob. There is a business in Edmonton that has in large, individual, lighted lettering,...a very expensive sign.
      Should read: Homeopathic Clinic,...reads: Homoeopathic Clinic.
      It actually could be that, but I wonder how the politically correct police didn't jump all over it.

      Bob replies: Maybe it's Latin.
    show more replies
  7. Chris posted on 06/05/2012 04:57 PM
    Ok so literacy is one thing hey I graduated in the 90’s; I still have problems with it. I was always better with numbers anyway.
    I have a Kid I just hired at 18 years just 6 mos. out of HS. He works in a labour position so reading and writing I am not too concerned about as long as he understands what the job pack tells him to do. You would think that it’s pretty straight forward thing for someone. As long as they have the right training and know how right!
    The thing I don’t understand and I need help with is so unbelievable. So the person in question is told to do something. Someone takes him under their wing and explains to this guy the steps of a job. Funny thing he just doesn’t get it. OK this is fine some people need a little extra help sometimes, you know new job jitters and whatnot. So they literally then show him how to do the work and he still doesn’t get it. So they continue to help and show him how to do the job start to finish, until the job is done. He still doesn’t understand why, what, when, where, and the how’s of it. This isn’t the worst part of it, he was told to sweep the floor.
  8. John in Edmonton posted on 06/05/2012 05:15 PM
    Well Bob, I received a resume from a young man who printed the entire application in "Text" language. Needless to say I could not understand a single word.However, we also hired a young very articulate young man who only lasted a week. He did not believe he had to actually work. I've encountered a young lady who insisted she needed to get paid as her name was on the schedule for two weeks---but she never showed up to actually work.I'm sure these young people has a high school diploma, in light of what we've seen in tha past few days---are we surprised???
  9. Joanne posted on 06/05/2012 06:56 PM
    I thought part of learning was to learn how to write. My kids never had to learn how to write, they always printed. Is there any sense of secure Identity then to have a signature in writing. I know my kids are not the only ones that never learned to write.
  10. Sandra Ellis posted on 06/05/2012 06:59 PM
    I can’t agree more with that Professor at the University! However…our child came home in grade 5 with a “C” in social and was very concerned considering she always seemed to obtain a grade of “A”! We did our parental duties and questioned the teacher as to why our child was struggling in this one course and why we had not been notified. Trying to unravel the mystery on our own we searched through our daughters books, and found only one graded assignment, a check mark no grade. A parent- teacher interview took place. Her teacher and principle gave us lots of excuses and showed us some sort of fancy grading system, but still couldn’t help us understand, As this wasn’t the end of the world we rolled our eyes and left. Later in that week our daughter came home ecstatic….she had raised her grade from a C to an A! Now these teachers graduated from the University. We agree there is no accountability in today’s world! The problem is you have to be taught accountability to teach accountability! This teacher learned it and is being punished for trying to teach it….shame on society!
  11. Bob $ posted on 06/06/2012 09:48 AM
    I've always maintained that there should be extra desks or at least chairs in every classroom where parents, at random, can sit in and observe what is being taught to their children, how it is being taught, and also to observe the behavior and conduct of their children, as well as the behavior and conduct of other children. Do you think this would assist the teachers,...I think it would,...and in particular with the conduct of all the children. This should be instituted all the way through high school.
    I don't understand how people send their children for 12+ years with never seeing and hearing how they receive instruction...and are surprised if they don't turn out the way they "expected" they should!
  12. KarenC1425 posted on 06/06/2012 02:42 PM This comment was edited by a moderator at 05:48 PM on 06/06/2012
    Hi Bob,

    I had to laugh at your post. I teach elementary school (cannot give out a zero) and have been battling with my students over their inability to write a sentence without spelling mistakes and without random apostrophes tossed in wherever they see a plural "s." Your editorial described my class to a T. Next thing to battle is times tables.... ("Can't I just use the table in my agenda??")

    I do have one comment to make about spoken English and it is something you might be able to help with. It's the inability for so many in the public - AND in the newsroom - to put an "ly" on the end of an adverb - and for the proper useage of the words "good and well." E.g. The Oilers didn't play "real good" on the road - they played "really well."

    Here's hoping you can help in one small way! My listening ears would appreciate it.

    Bob replies: I'm also fighting battles on that front.
    1. Bob $ posted on 06/07/2012 05:30 PM
      @KarenC1425 Then we could tackle the Goesintahs.....(showing my age).

      As Jethro Bodene would say: 2 goesinta 8, ah 4 times,...2 goesinta 4, ah 2 times,...2 goesinta 2, justa a oneah time,.......to the Mmmmmmmh "doggies" of Jed Clampett....but at least Jed Clampett was interested in his "progress!"
      He would be considered a university scholar by today's sub-standards....
      So,....why do we only have spelling Beez,....and not other kinds of Beez?
  13. Jo posted on 06/07/2012 10:59 AM
    I work at the U of A where I deal with all sorts of students – students right out of High School, Undergrads, Graduates, International students, mature students; you name it, I deal with it. What I see on a daily basis would shock anyone. For example, a third year Elementary Education student did not know how to spell ‘tuition’ or the word ‘forty’. Would you want her teaching your elementary aged children??? I wouldn’t.
    I believe there are a few reasons our young people are stunned when it comes to the ‘real world’. Number one – technology. The students are unaware of the world around them because they are focused on texting, tweeting, and their iPods full of loud music; they don’t even know how to communicate when they are in front of an actual human being. Nine times of out of ten the students don’t get off their phones when they are in front of me. I have to wait until they are done their call.
    Number two – helicopter parents. A lot of the new students have parents that ‘hover’ around them, and shelter them from what happens in the real world. The parents drag their children down to the U of A to pay for fees, go to the bookstore, and deal with any issues they may have. An involved parent is great, unless they do all the talking. The helicopter parent will not let their child even try and communicate with us; they do all the speaking, and their child stands there staring at their cell phone.
    We need to start treating these young ones about the real world – you don’t do the work, there will be consequences for your actions.
  14. Glen S.R. Woytuck posted on 06/07/2012 10:58 PM
    I have no idea what happened to education. I am a grade 11 dropout, and yet I am constantly amazed at the spelling/grammatical errors in memos/manuals put out by upper management. I must assume they have more education than I do to qualify for such a position, yet they lack skills I learned in Jr. High.
    As for your trade, I've seen much in print with atrocious errors. Not only are people in the print industry supposed to be professionals, I would also assume a higher degree of English proficiency to be a job requirement. (Most publishers have proofreaders too, do they not?)
    When I was in school, ALL papers were graded for spelling/grammar/punctuation, those in classes other than English were not as heavily deducted for errors, but it still counted.
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